Mannetosen Posted April 18, 2017 Report Share Posted April 18, 2017 his opponents arent large names or "impressive" because dj stomped the shit out of them. hes obviously the best fighter in the ufc right now and like erik i dont think its particularly close 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjornmma1 Posted April 18, 2017 Report Share Posted April 18, 2017 When you're fighting at the highest level of the MMA world, putting together a streak like that is super impressive. You're literally a half a second away from getting chin checked, shin to the face, one second away from getting your arm locked up or getting an arm stuck under your chin... It's easy to dismiss the hype around his opponents but you have to truly respect the people at the top of the game to understand how impressive his streak really is. I agree with you that his winning streak is amazing, but the lack of legendary opponents hurts his status in my opinion. It is not his fault, but there are just not big names there. If he would have been a MW and ran through all the top contenders there for example in a huge winning streak , that would be more impressive. That division is an absolute shark pool, while DJ his division isn't really. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timqwe Posted April 18, 2017 Report Share Posted April 18, 2017 I agree with you that his winning streak is amazing, but the lack of legendary opponents hurts his status in my opinion. It is not his fault, but there are just not big names there. If he would have been a MW and ran through all the top contenders there for example in a huge winning streak , that would be more impressive. That division is an absolute shark pool, while DJ his division isn't really.It's a chicken-egg story. MM is the first ever champion of the division, there are no legendary fighters because he keeps beating everyone. You can't tell me Joe B is a worse win than for instance Dan Henderson was for Silva. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLP Posted April 18, 2017 Report Share Posted April 18, 2017 Some people are starting to get sherdog forums level mma ignorant on here. Did you guys not just see MM counter a leaping Reis with a flying knee to the kidney? Did you miss it when he had Reis' back standing and kicked him in the head? The guy is on a whole next level right now. He's the top p4p fighter by a wide margin right now. He's dominating a deep and talented division despite being the noticeably smaller fighter in every fight hes had. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igorbyhenikov Posted April 18, 2017 Report Share Posted April 18, 2017 Too bad MM doesn't get paid. Would be cool if he was financially secured so he could take the risk to become a legend by going back up to 135. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket Posted April 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2017 His opponents are at the top level of MMA - albeit a little undersized lol. Do you think his opponents are less technical or less physically gifted than the other UFC champions? Not at all I already said he's dominant. I just don't agree he is the best by a long shot but again I already said I know I am bias because I don't like Mighty Mouse lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rambo Posted April 18, 2017 Report Share Posted April 18, 2017 I agree with you that his winning streak is amazing, but the lack of legendary opponents hurts his status in my opinion. It is not his fault, but there are just not big names there. If he would have been a MW and ran through all the top contenders there for example in a huge winning streak , that would be more impressive. That division is an absolute shark pool, while DJ his division isn't really. But Anderson Silva is a legend? Chris Leben Rich Franklin Travis Lutter * Nate Marquardt Rich Franklin Dan Henderson James Irvin * Patrick Cote Thales Leites Forrest Griffin * Demian Maia Chael Sonnen Vitor Belfort Yushin Okami Chael Sonnen Stephan Bonnar * * equivalent to Mighty Mouse going up in weight to fight somebody like Cody McKenzie... bold constitutes quality opponents. Keep in mind, Maia wasn't even close to the fighter then as he is today. The rest were middle of the road guys. MMA has evolved tremendously. It's a totally different game in today's MMA then it was when one-trick poney's like Matt Hughes could just steamroll through one dimensional opponents. The level of competition is much closer today than it's ever been. DJ is beating guys in their prime. He isn't beating old fighters on their way out the door and he isn't taking "superfights" a weight class above his against dudes who aren't in the top 10 of their w/c (i.e. Irvin, Bonnar, Griffin). MMA records since fighting Jon Jones Shogun (6-5) Evans (2-4) Vitor (4-4) Sonnen (1-2) and was coming off a loss to get a title shot... Machida (5-4) Vitor, Glover, DC, Rashad, Gustafson were undoubtedly in their primes when Jones fought them. Very impressive wins, even though Vitor was a MW moving up to LHW iirc. I didn't add Machida to Jones' list because he was 1-2 in his last 3 with his win coming over a 49 year old Randy Couture lol. He may have been in his prime but questionable receiving a title shot after beating Randy... Anyway. Lost my train of thought. Went through a lot of effort here for some reason lol. I just don't understand how people can say things like "he's not beating enough legends"... since when did quality of opponents become a popularity contest? The guys he is fighting are way more well rounded than most of the dudes on Jon Jones and Anderson Silva's list. I don't think DJ has defended his title against one guy that's coming off a loss, and GSP, Jon Jones, Anderson Silva, they can't say that they never did. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket Posted April 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2017 But Anderson Silva is a legend? Chris LebenRich Franklin Travis Lutter * Nate Marquardt Rich Franklin Dan Henderson James Irvin * Patrick Cote Thales Leites Forrest Griffin * Demian Maia Chael Sonnen Vitor Belfort Yushin Okami Chael Sonnen Stephan Bonnar * * equivalent to Mighty Mouse going up in weight to fight somebody like Cody McKenzie... bold constitutes quality opponents. Keep in mind, Maia wasn't even close to the fighter then as he is today. The rest were middle of the road guys. MMA has evolved tremendously. It's a totally different game in today's MMA then it was when one-trick poney's like Matt Hughes could just steamroll through one dimensional opponents. The level of competition is much closer today than it's ever been. DJ is beating guys in their prime. He isn't beating old fighters on their way out the door and he isn't taking "superfights" a weight class above his against dudes who aren't in the top 10 of their w/c (i.e. Irvin, Bonnar, Griffin). MMA records since fighting Jon Jones Shogun (6-5) Evans (2-4) Vitor (4-4) Sonnen (1-2) and was coming off a loss to get a title shot... Machida (5-4) Vitor, Glover, DC, Rashad, Gustafson were undoubtedly in their primes when Jones fought them. Very impressive wins, even though Vitor was a MW moving up to LHW iirc. I didn't add Machinda to Jones' list because he was 1-2 in his last 3 with his win coming over a 49 year old Randy Couture lol. He may have been in his prime but questionable receiving a title shot after beating Randy... Anyway. Lost my train of thought. Went through a lot of effort here for some reason lol. I just don't understand how people can say things like "he's not beating enough legends"... since when did quality of opponents become a popularity contest? The guys he is fighting are way more well rounded than most of the dudes on Jon Jones and Anderson Silva's list. Spot on with this tbh, the more I go on the more I sound like a hater and I'm not. But looking back it's like GSP was so dominant people said he needed to go to MW. Silva needed to go to LHW and Jones to HW to fight cain. None of them needed to go up they where and still remain legends. DJ's legacy just suffers more due to his size I suppose Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rambo Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 Spot on with this tbh, the more I go on the more I sound like a hater and I'm not. But looking back it's like GSP was so dominant people said he needed to go to MW. Silva needed to go to LHW and Jones to HW to fight cain. None of them needed to go up they where and still remain legends. DJ's legacy just suffers more due to his size I suppose Size, lack of exposure (new division & UFC marketing possibly to blame too), and charisma doesn't really help. He's a true Mixed Martial Artist though and his streak is super impressive. It doesn't help that he doesn't have any poster worthy highlights that they replay over and over again like Silva had or the Showtime kick. I think the new division is really the biggest issue because a bunch of people just dismiss it as a Ronda Rousey thing where they're "beating up irrelevant way less talented people" and that's not the reality of it. We might not be as familiar with his opponents but he's beating up very technical, very skilled fighters, and not denying opponents or challengers because "money fights" or lack of an opponents popularity. He approaches MMA how the game should be played. I'm a huge McGregor and Mousasi fan. It'd hurt a little inside to watch them lose. Mighty Mouse I respect and won't discredit and I like watching him fight because he's very highly skilled and I respect it. I wouldn't necessarily call myself a fan of his though. I wouldn't be sad if the guy lost - unless it was to a Brazilian - I hate Brazilians lol. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramirez Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 But Anderson Silva is a legend? Chris Leben Rich Franklin Travis Lutter * Nate Marquardt Rich Franklin Dan Henderson James Irvin * Patrick Cote Thales Leites Forrest Griffin * Demian Maia Chael Sonnen Vitor Belfort Yushin Okami Chael Sonnen Stephan Bonnar * * equivalent to Mighty Mouse going up in weight to fight somebody like Cody McKenzie... bold constitutes quality opponents. Keep in mind, Maia wasn't even close to the fighter then as he is today. The rest were middle of the road guys. MMA has evolved tremendously. It's a totally different game in today's MMA then it was when one-trick poney's like Matt Hughes could just steamroll through one dimensional opponents. The level of competition is much closer today than it's ever been. DJ is beating guys in their prime. He isn't beating old fighters on their way out the door and he isn't taking "superfights" a weight class above his against dudes who aren't in the top 10 of their w/c (i.e. Irvin, Bonnar, Griffin). MMA records since fighting Jon Jones Shogun (6-5) Evans (2-4) Vitor (4-4) Sonnen (1-2) and was coming off a loss to get a title shot... Machida (5-4) Vitor, Glover, DC, Rashad, Gustafson were undoubtedly in their primes when Jones fought them. Very impressive wins, even though Vitor was a MW moving up to LHW iirc. I didn't add Machida to Jones' list because he was 1-2 in his last 3 with his win coming over a 49 year old Randy Couture lol. He may have been in his prime but questionable receiving a title shot after beating Randy... Anyway. Lost my train of thought. Went through a lot of effort here for some reason lol. I just don't understand how people can say things like "he's not beating enough legends"... since when did quality of opponents become a popularity contest? The guys he is fighting are way more well rounded than most of the dudes on Jon Jones and Anderson Silva's list. I don't think DJ has defended his title against one guy that's coming off a loss, and GSP, Jon Jones, Anderson Silva, they can't say that they never did. well said mate! dj's competition is outrageously under rated, he has faced well rounded mma fighters for years, Benavidez only lost to Cruz at 135lbs, Cejudo is an Olympic champion... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mannetosen Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 I agree with you that his winning streak is amazing, but the lack of legendary opponents hurts his status in my opinion. It is not his fault, but there are just not big names there. If he would have been a MW and ran through all the top contenders there for example in a huge winning streak , that would be more impressive. That division is an absolute shark pool, while DJ his division isn't really. part of why he hasnt had many 'legendary' opponents is that the division is like 5 years old (in ufc terms). even so he gave dominick cruz hell while working full time in a warehouse, beat benavidez twice (a guy who was the consensus #2 bw for ages), beat down dodson who has done well at bw (ask tj dillashaw..), and so on and so forth. hell ian mccall is a fucking legend and beat the shit out of dj in their first fight but the second wasnt particularly close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefty Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 I find DJ entertaining. His skill is entertaining. This is what I look for in MMA fighters. The talk and the personality is just a small part of it really. He should for sure be moving up in weight to 135 lbs because it looks like he has few challenges at 125 but that is the only thing he needs to do. You can't ask a guy to change his personality, all you can ask of him is to do his best and that is what he does every time he fights. And his victory mighty mouse thing is great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steel Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 For me he has all the skills but I've seen JLP say it's a deep and talented division. As a European he's the size of a 14 year old kid , guys that small are an exception and get a second look for being so tiny. We've a midget at work 5ft 4 or 5 and my kids 14 and 10 joke about kicking his ass and they are girls. So while he's amazing there's always that , how many guys are this small , that are great athletes, train MMA or even do sports and happen to be hard as fuck to boot? Unless outside Europe the average male is the same height as my 14 year old daughter was 12 months ago the issue surely is number of fishies in the tank? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steel Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 The issue being marketable and recognition for his undoubted talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefty Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 I highly doubt that Europe has such small people, let's not forget Germany and the Netherlands where people are like 6ft tall average. Overall in europe the average height is 5'10''. You are right about the other thing though: not many small dudes who are great athletes and train MMA, I agree for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenlow73 Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 My favorite thing about DJ is not his fights but that one time he was streaming a gaming session and USADA showed up to his house for a random sample. http://youtu.be/N2GJPfKEh0k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjornmma1 Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 part of why he hasnt had many 'legendary' opponents is that the division is like 5 years old (in ufc terms). even so he gave dominick cruz hell while working full time in a warehouse, beat benavidez twice (a guy who was the consensus #2 bw for ages), beat down dodson who has done well at bw (ask tj dillashaw..), and so on and so forth. hell ian mccall is a fucking legend and beat the shit out of dj in their first fight but the second wasnt particularly close. That the division is still very new, that hurts him indeed. That is what I was saying as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steel Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 The division is only 5 years old, mmm most humans have outgrown the division by the time they're 5 years old. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timqwe Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 For me he has all the skills but I've seen JLP say it's a deep and talented division. As a European he's the size of a 14 year old kid , guys that small are an exception and get a second look for being so tiny. We've a midget at work 5ft 4 or 5 and my kids 14 and 10 joke about kicking his ass and they are girls. So while he's amazing there's always that , how many guys are this small , that are great athletes, train MMA or even do sports and happen to be hard as fuck to boot? Unless outside Europe the average male is the same height as my 14 year old daughter was 12 months ago the issue surely is number of fishies in the tank? That gets ofset by two things. 1. There are a lot of Asians, and quite some Hispanics that size. Heck, some Asian orgs even have male atomweight divisions. Also, there is very little competion for athletes. Flyweightso can basically only be successful in combatssports, while middleweight and higher will have athletic people going to American football/basketball etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mannetosen Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 That the division is still very new, that hurts him indeed. That is what I was saying as well. Thats not really relevant though when a large portion of his wins are vs either really good bantams or the best flyweights in the world from before the ufc added 125. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mentor Posted April 21, 2017 Report Share Posted April 21, 2017 I like the guy, but unless he moves up a division, he will never ever be considered anything more than the King of the Midgets, he has basically cleaned the floor of his whole division and it is time to move on to 135. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimCornette Posted April 21, 2017 Report Share Posted April 21, 2017 He just lacks competition. I personally find him incredibly exciting.He is up there with Jones, Silva, Fedor, GSP, and e.t.c.The GOAT argument is becoming so complicated in MMA now, so many different potential players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mannetosen Posted April 22, 2017 Report Share Posted April 22, 2017 I like the guy, but unless he moves up a division, he will never ever be considered anything more than the King of the Midgets, he has basically cleaned the floor of his whole division and it is time to move on to 135. Did you say the same thing about GSP? Seeing as DJ was a title contender at 135 even though he was working a full time job at the same time I think this reasoning is really stupid. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mentor Posted April 22, 2017 Report Share Posted April 22, 2017 What i am saying is that he needs new competition, he has already cleared out his division so beating a bunch of unknown talent won't help his legacy. Not saying he will find that competition at 135lbs, but he needs to do something. GSP was never in the same position because he was fighting at 170lbs, one of the deepest divisions in the UFC, not some newly formed midget division. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tycooner Posted April 22, 2017 Report Share Posted April 22, 2017 The way i look at it is if every one in mma was the same size who wins based on there skill set ? I think Mighty Mouse would have a real good shot at beating any of them 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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