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I don't think 15,000 people dieing isn't worth a shit. I think that's a massive amount of people when you consider it's a one off cost for an indefinite change in culture. Multiply it over a decade and you've saved a small city worth of people.

 

more people die from alcohol related wrecks (dui's) than guns -- more people die from high speed wrecks (non dui) then guns (not even mentioning cigs or illegal drugs - yea the banning and making those illegal worked so good so far) -- so those two things kill more than guns but nothing is being done or talked about on banning those (cause state and government makes too much money of those) ------ According to the FBI, there were 8,583 gun murders in the United States during 2011 around 2000 of them were done by police (around 1400) and citizens (around 600) cleared by justified homicide (self-defense)

 

also dont put alex jones as a progun person cause he isnt -- he is someone who just wants to be in spot light thus why he jumps on all the conspiracy deals and all -- he isnt a good example of a progun person --- and being a progun person no im not trying to arm every citizen -- most citizens dont need to be armed or have the right too be due to mental issues or criminal pasts -- it the perfect law abiding people losing the right -- im for stricter laws or not really stricter just enforce the ones now -- i also feel there should be no person to person sales unless the buyer passes a background check (something that isnt done now)

 

For me it's utterly baffling that you rather be a victim of a violent crime then have the ability to defend yourself -- and i think brainsmasher was making the point that if you had a gun to protect yourself then you most likely wouldnt of gotten beat up -- would you of had to use the weapon probably not just showing you have it to protect yourself is enough and they would of most likely ran -- there is always the "if" or "maybe"

 

edited: the main issue isnt the guns really cause they are proven to be used 80 times more often to prevent crime then in crime -- the issue is mental stability and mental issues -- this is what needs to be looked at and handled -- these people need help and this issue with guns is just to take away the real issue which is mental illness

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Stop using it as an excuse to own guns as "self defense" then. If nobody's scared, nobody needs a gun for self defense.

 

also has nothing to do with being scared -- its about having the ability to not be a victim of crime -- sorry that your country feels you should be victims of more crime than have the ability to defend yourself -- like i said before it's utterly baffling that you rather be a victim of a violent crime then have the ability to defend yourself -- maybe its cause you have never been able to defend yourself before thus dont know the feeling

 

myself i have been saved from being a victim of crime several times due to carrying a gun -- luckly i havent had to use the gun or shoot anyone but carrying it stopped the crime from happening and got the criminals off the street thus saving other citizens from them

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10 small facts -- im not 100% sure these numbers are correct but come from decent source

 

1 The UK has approximately 125 percent more rape victims per 100,000 people each year than the United States does.

 

2 The UK has approximately 133 percent more assault victims per 100,000 people each year than the United States does.

 

3 The United States is #1 in the world in gun ownership, and yet it is only 28th in the world in gun murders per 100,000 people.

 

4 The violent crime rate in the United States actually fell from 757.7 per 100,000 in 1992 to 386.3 per 100,000 in 2011. During that same time period, the murder rate fell from 9.3 per 100,000 to 4.7 per 100,000. This was during an era when gun laws in the United States generally became much less restrictive.

 

5 The city of Chicago has some of the strictest gun laws in the United States. So has this reduced crime? Of course not. As I wrote about the other day, the murder rate in Chicago was about 17 percent higher in 2012 than it was in 2011, and Chicago is now considered to be “the deadliest global city“.

 

6 After the city of Kennesaw, Georgia passed a law requiring every home to have a gun, the crime rate dropped by more than 50 percent over the course of the next 23 years.

 

7 Overall, guns in the United States are used 80 times more often to prevent crime than they are to take lives.

 

8 According to Gallup, an all-time record 74 percent of all Americans are against a total handgun ban in the United States.

 

9 Despite the very strict ban on guns in the UK, the truth is that the UK is a far more violent society than the United States is. In one recent year, there were 2,034 violent crimes per 100,000 people in the UK. In the United States, there were only 466 violent crimes per 100,000 people during that same year. Do we really want to be more like the UK?

 

10 According to Gun Owners of America, the governments of the world slaughtered more than 170 million of their own people during the 20th century. The vast majority of those people had been disarmed by their own governments prior to being slaughtered.

 

 

again self defense is not a b/s reason -- not being a victim of crime is reason enough

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Kill some, save many. Kill many, save some. Kill and Save many?

 

 

The majority of the population are border line retarded, and also keep in mind when comparing America to other countries that the USA has the 3rd highest population in the world at around 4.5% of the global population. Most countries don't even have 1%.

 

 

As an individual I feel entitled to own a gun. Just as entitled as I feel to own a sword, a fork, a knife, a car, a dog, a baseball bat, a candle stick, a lamp... it's not the item that kills, it's the person behind it. Do guns make it easier? For many it does, it also allows many others to protect themselves at another level of protection they couldn't have without it.

 

 

Comparing violent crime to gun crime, as if they're basically the same thing and swapping one for the other isn't any use, is completely nonsensical. I have been the victim of violent crime twice (i.e. jumped by a group of guys and had my head kicked in). All that's wrong with me is that I have two scars on my head and my jaw dislocates when I eat. If I'd been the victim of gun crime twice, I probably wouldn't be here. The two things are not even the same ball park.

 

If you would of had a gun you could of prevented that.

 

 

You might be okay with the scars and the jaw dislocating when you eat, but it doesn't mean that everybody should just suck it up and take one on the chin when a group of assholes wants to jump one person. You shoot/kill/hurt/scare them, they might not ever try to jump somebody again if they lived through the experience.

 

That video is Bullshit like Brainshmasher said. If i had a gun i would definitely practice.

 

They say it's difficult to defend with a gun, but then it is easy to attack with? It makes no sense should go both way.

 

Gun should be allowed end of story.

I agree with this for the most part, but they should do background checks more thoroughly and profile. Mental/psychological evaluation should be required as well but none of that stops the "black market" or the sale of guns (inlcuding legal bills of sale to non-felons) on the streets. Legal or illegal, guns will be a part of our daily existence til people forget how to build them. At least people with guns legally are on equal playing ground with the people who will always possess them illegally.

 

Anybody in the world can pull a trigger. Man, woman, or child. There's pro's and cons to this. Not everybody can take down a larger, faster, stronger assailant with a knife, bat, club, or bottle of mace.

 

Seeing as BrainSmasher mentioned his great, American freedom, I'm going to do something in his honor that I bet he's never done: Go outside without fearing for my life.

 

It's safe to assume that people have been killing each other before we could verbally communicate. Fist, teeth, rock, stick, stone, club, bone, sharp inanimate object, rope, clothe, sword, cannon, bomb, grenade, or guns... people will continue to kill each other. We're the most self-destructive 'parasite' to this planet; the more our population grows, the.more we fuck shit up. Like it or not it appears that it's in most of our DNA to destroy. Be it the planet or each other. Taking away guns doesn't change that, it might make it a bit more difficult. Eradicate the majority of the population and start from scratch and we'll still kill each other. Humans have and always will be genocidal. Think about how bloody and gruesome the world was throughout history. Hundreds of thousands of men, women, or children with swords, blades, axes, spikes, spears, whatever have you, bum rushing each other hacking and slashing away. People died on a mass level - much more massive than people die in today's wars which include an evolution of weapons. War will always exist until our exstinction, in some way, shape, or form.

 

You ProGUN people argue the wrong points. You all argue self defense... It's the most bullshit argument because its fucking fake. Outlawing guns would prevent more deaths, then it would save lives due to self defense. Theres no way around it. I've never walked with any sort of weapon and Ive never been jumped robbed carjacked gun point etc and I live 10 minutes away from one of the most dangerous US cities.

 

PERSONALLY, I'm on your side, Im progun too... But for a much more reasonable argument. IDK off the top of my head but i think weapon related homicide accounted for 15,000 deaths in the US this year.. Or a number roughly around that. Considering like 2.5 Million people die per year in the US... What is 15,000?

 

Also considering a lot of those deal with Drug Wars, Gang wars and that inner city type of life style.. The number is actually much lower.

 

So what you really should be arguing, Is the time and cost of taking guns off the streets worth saving a few thousand lives? No it's not, the millions and millions that will come from Tax Payers is not worth it. If your going to raise funds to save lives, forget about guns.. Put it towards Heart Disease and Cancer which are the #1 and #2 Killers BY A FUCKLOAD in the US.

 

I'm Sorry, i feel bad for Sandy Hook, its a great Tragedy.. I feel bad for Virginia Tech, its a great tragedy.. I feel bad for Columbine its a great Tragedy... But thats 80 people in 15 years. Thats a pebble of sand on a giant beach. It aint shit.. Considering in the last few weeks we've had a Flu outbreak that has killed more then all these school shootings and mall shootings and theatre shootings combined guns arn't a problem.

 

So you gunlovers need to start making some sense, because your arguments are not helping your case there just going to hurt your case. Selfdefense is the worst argument you can possibly think of.

 

Self defense is a viable argument. So are the ones you presented.

 

You want to prevent Sandy Hook? Give every teacher a firearm (no reason they shouldn't considering it's a government-type job, and convicted felons don't teach) they'd be able to defend themself and their class. Is it a solution? No. Is there a solution? Absolutely not. People go crazy.

 

You ban guns and there will still be the once in a million occassional psychopath that goes on a rampage in his truck, with a sword, home made bomb, you name it. There will be the occassional trigger happy police officer going on a spree. There will be the serial rapist or pedophile who strangles his victims.

 

I never sit around in my home fearing for my own life because I'm not a paranoid moron like you are. I've never been in any particular danger and I've never even had my wallet stolen despite not walking around with heavy artillery.

 

All it takes is one place at the wrong time. It could happen just about any where in the world, any neighborhood, any area. I have no objections to owning a firearm for protection. I think the majority of women (that are legally entitled to them) should own one because there's a rapist in every state, every country, and there's some really fucking creepy people out there. They might not be waiting around every corner to pounce, they might be spread out far and thin, but all it takes is one and one experience to change the course of her life forever. This really goes for just about anybody, given different circumstances.

 

guys well if guns become illegal then weed should become legal. you know a trade

 

Just make weed legal and allow it to grow on the side of the road and everywhere else naturally (it's a plant, produces oxygen) and I'd be willing to bet that the murder rate decreases significantly.

 

The big problem in the US is drugs. It is the root of most problems with guns. The drug problem right now is to bad to unarm ourselves. Also the liberals want to keep letting criminals out of prison and have turned prison into a summer camp. It is t a detourant and they are quickly back on the street. Most killers have a huge rapsheet and should have been locked up long before killing someone.

The big problem in the US are people. People are idiots. Guns, drugs, sex, violance, or rock & roll, people will continue to kill each other. Not all killers are criminals. Most serial killers aren't career criminals with a rap sheet.

 

Lui Pengli

Gilles de Rais

Thug Behram and the Thuggee cult of assassins

Jack The Ripper

Elizabeth Bathory

 

Hell even modernized: Charles Manson, Jeffery Dahmer, Hannibal Lecter... compared to these sick fucks, a lot of the people killing each other with guns are saints.

 

 

If you ask me it seems like people are the problem, and there's nothing that's going to change "people" except extinction. It's unfortunate but that's the way it is.

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You want to prevent Sandy Hook? Give every teacher a firearm (no reason they shouldn't considering it's a government-type job, and convicted felons don't teach) they'd be able to defend themself and their class. Is it a solution? No. Is there a solution? Absolutely not. People go crazy.

 

this example shows it can help and stop violence from happening

 

On Oct. 1, 1997, in Pearl, Miss., Joel Myrick, the assistant principal of Pearl High School, ran to his car to retrieve his .45-caliber handgun and proceeded to confront Luke Woodham, who had killed his mother, then drove to the school to shoot others. When Myrick confronted Woodham, the carnage was stopped. Woodham killed two before Myrick confronted and stopped him but at least he saved more lives.

 

just think if that principal would of been at columbine then it would of probably been stopped also -- yea maybe he would of been killed too, there is always that chance but at least he (a true citizen) had more balls then the police and swat did at columbine -- they sat outside the school for 30 mins listening to them kill more people without entering the school -- and most say we have police to protect us -- pffft -- yea when seconds count they are only 30 mins away from entering

 

like i say too and has you somewhat mention -- evil will always continue to do evil

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lol stupid gun nuts make me laugh, your arguments are so fucking dumb -- your graphs don't even account for population growth, your lack of understanding of basic statistics is fucking laughable.

 

As for your "guns protect us from the government" argument: you've got more people imprisoned than the soviet union, warrantless wiretapping and indefinite imprisonment. You don't get to lecture the rest of the world about freedom.

 

P.s. here's a chart for you stupid cbombs, more military/police grade weapons per person = more gun deaths.

 

http://static3.businessinsider.com/image/50cf5c5eecad049f7a000004-1785-1483-590-/deaths-vs-guns.png

 

Statistics never capture the whole truth, as they never account for the variables...indert any quote about statistics you'd like.

 

Not sure why you despise the United States so much, as you've bashed the US on several occasions.You're always so irate, as if some American citizen once upon a time gave you a wedgie. Seriously, chill the fuck out. Until you've lived in this country you'll never understand, just as I don't pretend to understand Australia better than you. I guess it's easy to hate on the other side of the world. Have a pleasant evening friend.

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more people die from alcohol related wrecks (dui's) than guns -- more people die from high speed wrecks (non dui) then guns -- so those two things kill more than guns but nothing is being done or talked about on banning those (cause state and government makes too much money of those) ------ According to the FBI, there were 8,583 gun murders in the United States during 2011 around 2000 of them were done by police (around 1400) and citizens (around 600) cleared by justified homicide (self-defense)

 

also dont put alex jones as a progun person cause he isnt -- he is someone who just wants to be in spot light thus why he jumps on all the conspiracy deals and all -- he isnt a good example of a progun person --- and being a progun person no im not trying to arm every citizen -- most citizens dont need to be armed or have the right too be due to mental issues or criminal pasts -- it the perfect law abiding people losing the right -- im for stricter laws or not really stricter just enforce the ones now -- i also feel there should be no person to person sales unless the buyer passes a background check (something that isnt done now)

 

Lose the right to what? Have a gun? Seriously... that may sound like a sentence an adult would say in America because it's become so desensitised but anywhere else in the developed world, "it's my right to have a gun" sounds completely and utterly idiotic. People have the right to plenty of things. Justice, equal rights, freedom from persecution.... Owning a gun? It's insulting to things that people really should have their rights protected over, to put a gun in the same category.

 

If someone wants one that's fine. I'm all for someone explaining why they want one and justifying it sensibly but just saying "cos it's my right" is flat out nonsense.

 

I have a simple question. It either fundamentally makes sense to have private, urban gun ownership, or it doesn't. Pretty much every other civilised country in the world thinks it doesn't make any sense at all so why is America right and everyone else is wrong?

 

As for Alex Jones not being pro gun, well he is pro gun so you've confused me there. And he's appointed himself as some sort of spokesperson and plenty of people listen to him. Clearly, he's not a good example of anything other than an idiot though.

 

The comparing of alcohol as something to be banned is the one thing that I think is an interesting thing to talk about, though I don't think not banning alcohol should in any way be justification for not banning guns or a particular type of gun. The two things are interesting to compare in terms of logic but are fundamentally different. At least if we're comparing the two, then we're forced to actually look at things logically and not just say "cos it's my right".

 

A good place to start is what's the purpose of something? The purpose of a gun is to shoot a bit of metal at something else. They were invented to kill humans. The purpose of alcohol is what? I dunno. Ambiguous. It wasn't invented, it just exists and always will exist because it's produced naturally. Used in moderation it's good but it ruins a lot of lives. Another important question would be is it even possible to ban it? Probably not because it's really not hard to make alcohol. I even make alcohol when I don't want to. I have tropical fish and alcohol is made as a byproduct of the DIY CO2 system I have set up to feed the aquarium's plants. Alcohol is in medicine. It's used in cooking. It's produced naturally by fruit just as they lie on the floor under a tree. If you banned commercial alcohol, probably the people that have the most issues with alcohol now, would just make their own. It would be kind of pointless. If you banned guns, some of the people you'd least like to have guns wouldn't have them but it's a lot harder to make guns than it is to make alcohol. Ban guns and you don't have guns just lying around in grandpa's cabinet, ready for the latest massacre. There's lots that you can talk about and at least there's some logical discussion to be had.

 

 

Anyway, I think that talking about things in large scale statistical terms dehumanises things. Thousands of people? What does that even mean?

 

Like I metioned before, I'd quite happily have CCTV watch me all day every day if it meant it saved one person's life. Why not just focus this down to one incident? If there was no domestic gun ownership, those kids in Connecticut wouldn't be dead. So is it more important to you [anyone who owns a gun and keeps it at home], that you have that gun and keep it in your home, than those kids being alive? Forget the other massacres, just this one. It's a pretty simple question.

 

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/12/15/article-2248197-168579C1000005DC-946_634x452.jpg

This kid comes into a school with anything other than a gun, nobody dies. This kid has anything other than easy access to a gun, from a family home, nobody dies.

 

Read through these 26 pages and tell me why it's more important that ANYONE keeps a gun in their home, than these people dying. Not just dying, dying in absolute terror by being shot to pieces by a semi-automatic weapon.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/sandy-hook-elementary-school-shooting-victims/story?id=17984685#1

http://timenewsfeed.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/nf-sandy-hook-victims-1217.jpg

 

My girlfriend is a teacher. She's 30. Her name isn't Lauren Rousseau but it might as well be. There's no reason to dehumanise these people. They're someone else's wife, girlfriend or child and their life is, sorry, was, no less important than mine or yours.

 

I don't want people to not be able to own guns. I just don't want any old crazy person to be able to own one and I don't want any old crazy person to be able to get their hands on one really easily either. I don't see why anyone should be able to keep a gun in an urban home; just keep it at a gun range. How is there anything wrong with that? If that was how it worked, none of these people would be dead.

Perpetrator's mother

  • Nancy Lanza, 52 (shot at home)

School staff

  • Rachel D'Avino, 29, teacher's aide[59]
  • Dawn Hochsprung, 47, principal
  • Anne Marie Murphy, 52, teacher's aide[60]
  • Lauren Rousseau, 30, teacher
  • Mary Sherlach, 56, school psychologist
  • Victoria Leigh Soto, 27, teacher

Students

  • Charlotte Bacon, 6
  • Daniel Barden, 7
  • Olivia Engel, 6
  • Josephine Gay, 7
  • Dylan Hockley, 6
  • Madeleine Hsu, 6
  • Catherine Hubbard, 6
  • Chase Kowalski, 7
  • Jesse Lewis, 6
  • Ana Marquez-Greene, 6
  • James Mattioli, 6
  • Grace McDonnell, 7
  • Emilie Parker, 6
  • Jack Pinto, 6
  • Noah Pozner, 6
  • Caroline Previdi, 6
  • Jessica Rekos, 6
  • Avielle Richman, 6
  • Benjamin Wheeler, 6
  • Allison Wyatt, 6

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also has nothing to do with being scared -- its about having the ability to not be a victim of crime -- sorry that your country feels you should be victims of more crime than have the ability to defend yourself -- like i said before it's utterly baffling that you rather be a victim of a violent crime then have the ability to defend yourself -- maybe its cause you have never been able to defend yourself before thus dont know the feeling

 

myself i have been saved from being a victim of crime several times due to carrying a gun -- luckly i havent had to use the gun or shoot anyone but carrying it stopped the crime from happening and got the criminals off the street thus saving other citizens from them

That post makes zero sense whatsoever. How am I not able to defend myself if neither I nor someone attacking me has a gun (in the street, outside a club), but I am able to defend myself if I have the right to own a gun? You want me to carry a gun in the club? Carry it everywhere just in case? Brilliant. Hopefully everyone does that then everyone will be much safer. And how exactly would that help when I got blindsided? Absolutely mindbogglingly nonsensical logic and depressing that you can't see that.

 

So what if I got beaten up twice? It really doesn't matter. I went home and went to bed. The point is that over here you don't need a gun to defend yourself against anything. Virtually the only violence that ever happens to anyone innocent/non gang related, is drunk pub violence, which is annoying. Someone getting shot dead is a bit worse than annoying. If someone gets stabbed here in the roughest area of the country, on so slow day it makes national news. If that happens over there, it's as inconsequential as a dog farting. It's just a totally different world.

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You ProGUN people argue the wrong points. You all argue self defense... It's the most bullshit argument because its fucking fake. Outlawing guns would prevent more deaths, then it would save lives due to self defense. Theres no way around it. I've never walked with any sort of weapon and Ive never been jumped robbed carjacked gun point etc and I live 10 minutes away from one of the most dangerous US cities.

 

PERSONALLY, I'm on your side, Im progun too... But for a much more reasonable argument. IDK off the top of my head but i think weapon related homicide accounted for 15,000 deaths in the US this year.. Or a number roughly around that. Considering like 2.5 Million people die per year in the US... What is 15,000?

 

Also considering a lot of those deal with Drug Wars, Gang wars and that inner city type of life style.. The number is actually much lower.

 

So what you really should be arguing, Is the time and cost of taking guns off the streets worth saving a few thousand lives? No it's not, the millions and millions that will come from Tax Payers is not worth it. If your going to raise funds to save lives, forget about guns.. Put it towards Heart Disease and Cancer which are the #1 and #2 Killers BY A FUCKLOAD in the US.

 

I'm Sorry, i feel bad for Sandy Hook, its a great Tragedy.. I feel bad for Virginia Tech, its a great tragedy.. I feel bad for Columbine its a great Tragedy... But thats 80 people in 15 years. Thats a pebble of sand on a giant beach. It aint shit.. Considering in the last few weeks we've had a Flu outbreak that has killed more then all these school shootings and mall shootings and theatre shootings combined guns arn't a problem.

 

So you gunlovers need to start making some sense, because your arguments are not helping your case there just going to hurt your case. Selfdefense is the worst argument you can possibly think of.

 

 

Yeah putting a price tag on peoples and kids life is a great way to win people over lol.

 

On the local news today. Man kills old man and is on the loose. Another old man calls the news to say he is scared he will be next but doesnt leave his name. He is later found dead. His next door neighbor has a run in with the killer who broke into his house and he scared him off with HIS gun. His report lead the police to the guy who ended up killing him. So you want to take this old mans gun away who showed exactly why we have them. If he gets killed maybe the killer is not caught for a long time. Maybe he kills 20 more people. Thankfully not everyone is pussies like you passive liberal sheep! I know you guys will say a gun ban would have taken the killers gun. Well maybe it would maybe it wouldnt. He will always be able to get a gun of some type legal or illegal. Black market or hunting. But this was a younger guy who killed 2 old men. He didnt really need a weapon at all. He could have killed them with a stick. BUt the old men did need a weapon to defend themselves. Sadly the man who feared for his life didnt have a weapon and was a sitting duck.

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I never sit around in my home fearing for my own life because I'm not a paranoid moron like you are. I've never been in any particular danger and I've never even had my wallet stolen despite not walking around with heavy artillery.

 

 

Neither have i jackass. So stop claiming other people fear for their lives when you have no clue what you are talkign about. There are millions of people who will never have a problem with or without guns. But people like you are the first to cry when shit hits the fan and want someone to save you while you are to stupid to save your self. I will bet every penny i have that if you and i were in a room and we heard someone breaking in and gun shots. I have an extra gun you would not turn it down. So stop all your bullshit that guns for self defense dont help. Your just a bunch of hippicrites who want to endanger everyone else just because you might not be effected.

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I have to side with Mike on this one. We had almost 32k gun deaths in 2011. 11.5k were homicide. Britain had 35. That is 328 times as many. Their population is 63 million while ours is 320 million. So, we have 5 times as many people and 328 times as many gun homicides. People with a gun in their home are 15 times more likely to be shot than those who don't, so it also goes against the claim having the gun makes you more safe. I do sport shooting and hunting. Due to my time in the Marines I am very familiar and comfortable with guns. But, I have common sense about their uses and risks. The fact is the constitution specifically cites well regulated militias as the reason for allowing guns. Where is your state militia card? When the 2nd was written the US did not have a standing military. They relied on well regulated militias to defend our country. That is no longer the case.

 

We don't even need to ban everything. Might not even have to ban anything besides any clip that can hold more than 10 rounds. Let's start somewhere simple the GOP has been working their tails off to block. Get rid of the internet/gun show loophole. What is the point of requiring a background check if anyone who buys online or in a gun show can legally ignore that law? Require mental evaluations. Require owners to be certified each year in gun safety. 3 very easy things that should not be controversial at all, but people flip out every time they come up. The crazy or criminal should not be allowed to carry. Period.

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What is the rates on homicides? becuse ok you have less gun homicide but as far as I know UK isnt far from not violent country it kinda doesnt matter killed my gun or knife.

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What is the rates on homicides? becuse ok you have less gun homicide but as far as I know UK isnt far from not violent country it kinda doesnt matter killed my gun or knife.

In 2011 the US had 14,748 and the UK had 722. So, the US had 20.4 times as many but their population is only 5 times as many. So, the US's homicide rate is just over 4 times as much as the UK's.

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Well doh - that's because your government has decided for you that you shouldn't be in fear. It happens to everyone who is not pro gun. It's not free thought at all - you are conditioned by your government. They have already made your mind up for you. Only a pro gun person has free thought.

 

Sarcasm aside it think it's a sign of a week argument to make out someone who is not pro gun has in some way had their mind made up for them already.

 

 

Well its a damn good bet when they have never had the option to have a gun and their life has been spent in a society that banned them and has no experience with them. They only hear one side. How could they have any other opinion? You think UK has so many people in support of a gun ban when it happen compared to now? You weeded out an entire generation while the current doesnt know any better and only know the system forced apon them.

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In 2011 the US had 14,748 and the UK had 722. So, the US had 20.4 times as many but their population is only 5 times as many. So, the US's homicide rate is just over 4 times as much as the UK's.

 

IS the possible you can get stats on have many of these have done by afro americans and latinos?

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This appears to me to be a bad argument. I'm pretty sure that, taken as a whole, the UK is much more urbanised than the US. I'm giving rough figures but I believe the UK has about 20% the population of USA, while being about 3% in land area (I know that includes Alaska, deserts and mountains, but still). In other words, UK is MORE crowded and MORE people live in cities.

 

EDIT: Had to look to see if I was right after posting. According to the UN, in 2002, the UK was 20th most urbanised nation in the world, and USA 44th. Under population density, the UK is rated #48 and the USA #168.

 

 

Coime on now. You can mislead anyone with numbers. They dont mean anything. The US has very large areas with low population. The Dakotas for example. In these areas the crime rate is extremely low. Again where there is a large population the crime sky rockets. Most of our crime in condensed into the urban areas. The gun toting rednecks you like to think of gun owners as actually have low crime rates in their area.

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I am going to sleep but I will leave it this here. I read somewhere that 90% of gun homocide and 80% homocides in USA are done by non-whites SO maybe let have guns only for whites? Seems that they are only ones who use them for self protection.

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Let's keep racism out of this. Color is not a factor. Typically economic status is a much greater indicator. Minorities do tend to have less money placing them in more urban areas that are prone to such violence, but it has nothing to do with color. The only area color does seem to have an actual effect is in the death penalty rates. When you kill a white person you are vastly more likely to get the death penalty. Since white people are more likely to kill other white people and black people to kill black people due to them being your neighbors that means white people do tend to get the death penalty a lot more. Some like to claim it is caused by discrimination against whites, but studies have shown time and again it is really caused by the color of the victim and not the killer.

 

Either way, socio-economic status is a much greater indicator than color. It can be argued that is because rich can just get away with it easier or tend to do more white collared crime, but that is for another day.

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