Ground / Wrestling need fixed ASAP

[JimCornette]

 

Since you can't use feints to set up TD, 'spamming' and selecting 100% on slider setting isn't that far off. There are levels and stages of takedowns IRL. in this game it's a simple 1 move = 1 dice roll, pass or fail. irl you shoot for td, you have leg, fighter doesn't go down, he's bouncing around, fighter keeps trying to drive him down, fighter stays on feet, push against cage, constantly persistent in taking fighter down. we see it all the time. 1 TD in an MMA fight is more often than not multiple (Takedown) attempts at dragging/putting/getting the guy down.

 

Matt Hughes

GSP

Chael Sonnen

Mark Coleman

Yushin Okami

Jon Fitch

Ben Askren

Travis Lutter

Travis Lutter

Ryan Hall

Matt Hughes, GSP, Sonnen, Okami, Fitch, Ryan and Lutter all use at least a jab to set-up their takedowns.

 

Ben Askren is a one-of-a-kind fighter fighting subpar competition with INSANE, best in the world wrestling skills to make his style work. You should have to be the best wrestler in the game to spam takedowns like that.

 

If you can't throw a single strike to set-up your takedown, your build is dookie. If anything you proved my point.

[Guest]

Demian Maia.

 

Also the ground game is shit.

[BillyRose]

i for one am thankful for billy rose, a man whose best fighter whores qfcs, and his smug insights into top level fights

 

My "best fighter" is a SparBot who I picked up from FA.

 

 

Why would I sign him to an org if his training is going to be shit? Use your brain limp-dick.

[Rambo]

Matt Hughes, GSP, Sonnen, Okami, Fitch, Ryan and Lutter all use at least a jab to set-up their takedowns.

 

Ben Askren is a one-of-a-kind fighter fighting subpar competition with INSANE, best in the world wrestling skills to make his style work. You should have to be the best wrestler in the game to spam takedowns like that.

 

If you can't throw a single strike to set-up your takedown, your build is dookie. If anything you proved my point.

 

lol. okay.

 

 

Elite++ Wrestling Primary

Elite++ BJJ Primary

Elite++ Agility, Strength, Flex, Cardio, Balance, Speed (elite-- speed)

Elite++ Takedown Secondary

Elite++ Sub Offense Secondary

Elite++ Transitions

Elite++ Def Grappling

 

2 x TWGC Division 1 Champion

 

 

what constitutes best wrestler in the game? you seriously can't statistically get any better than that. No hidden deficiency; 110+ IQ, Good confidence (didn't drop morale), and popped determined/heart.

 

 

the grappling aspect of this game needs a massive overhaul.

 

 

 

 

btw. most of those fighters outside of GSP (had one of best jabs in mma during his era imo) throw punches with no intentions on hitting the opponent and simply to go up top and shoot low. they're feints.

[Rambo]

and the fight I'm complaining about, the grappler couldn't take down a 44 year old 195 cm Middleweight with remarkable wrestling and a blue belt in BJJ.

 

If my guy would of got KO'd in the first round I would of never made the thread. The thread comes after an entire fight of statistical evidence that something needs improved/tweaking.

 

I couldn't care less about the loss, it's irrelevant fight with sparbot, but the fact that there's an obvious flaw in the mechanics of the game disturbs me and demoralizes many.

[Mannetosen]

 

My "best fighter" is a SparBot who I picked up from FA.

 

 

Why would I sign him to an org if his training is going to be shit? Use your brain limp-dick.

 

doesnt really change my point darling

[JakeF]

Yah, rather hear opinions from people who have actually experienced the ground game at elite skills level. Comparing UFC to the game's fight engine is totally irrelevant when it comes to ground game.

[Mentor]

 

It's not fiddling around with the ground game, it's about saving the game by restoring some balance. Striking tycoon is fucking annoying and boring. The engine does not need to be rebuild, just do some tweaks so that it's sensible again. Any other update is pointless if this is not done.

 

I am not saying the ground game cannot or should not be tweaked, however there is serious implications to all these changes. For one, fighter development takes ages, months. If you suddenly alter what is effective, it basically means that your fighter build can become obsolete. In the past changes to the fight engine ALWAYS lead to players leaving, the changes never increased players coming into the game though. So why make a change that can decrease members even more?

 

There is one other thing, past changes to the fight engine did not always lead to a better overall game, in fact i could argue that in some cases it made things worse. Can this game really afford another mistake? Let's all be honest here, the game overall is going downhill and that has been the case for a while, things are so bad that people i never thought i would even talk to, i am now collaborating with, simply because we do not have a lot of choice, there is so few active members that you have to find a compromise. A change like this could be the final blow to many top level managers who are on the verge of leaving. Besides this, most people would agree that the fight engine is at least playable, there are other parts of this game which need sorting out. Those changes will only enhance the game and will increase the player enjoyment in general.

[JakeF]

It goes both ways - lack of game improvements and game-engine updates in particular makes even more people leave on a daily basis.

[BillyRose]

 

doesnt really change my point darling

 

If you could comprehend anything written above a 3rd grade level you'd find that it does.

 

Looking at your top fighter right now myself... nice 1-0 QFC record.

 

Haha shitstain.

[JimCornette]

If comparing the game to real life MMA is irrelevant, what the fuck are we even doing here? This game is a simulation of mixed martial arts. It should be a simulation of a real MMA fight. Aren't we looking to have the more realistic MMA simulation possible? If so, why would you build a fighter any different than you would in real life? Or why would you change the engine to reflect something unrealistic?

"By the way, most of those fighters outside of GSP don't even throw strikes to hit their target."

1) That isn't true

2) You named like ten fighters from pre-UFC 100 days. Why don't you try to find some modern examples? Why would you try to build a fighter like Matt Hughes, who is undoubtedly completely outdated. We know in 2017 that if you aren't well rounded, you aren't going anywhere in MMA. Even Demian Maia spent years becoming a very competent striker before being able to be successful. It says in the WIKI not to build UFC 1 style fighters. Well, you probably shouldn't build UFC 50 style fighters either.

[JakeF]

How many black/red belts are in the UFC and how many are in this game?

 

Truth is that striking is heavily favored in this game and just having elite def grappling + some transitions/escapes is enough to be solid on the ground vs fighters who spent at least half of their skill cap mastering the ground game. Either make tweaks to ground skills effect (nerfing escapes/def grappling) or somehow limit primary skills so not every fighter is Elite wrestler/Brown and above BJJ belt - though as the fight of CK proves, that might not be enough.

[Mannetosen]

If you could comprehend anything written above a 3rd grade level you'd find that it does.

 

Looking at your top fighter right now myself... nice 1-0 QFC record.

 

Haha shitstain.

look at my manager record and previous ranking.

[BillyRose]

look at my manager record and previous ranking.

 

Oh now context matters?

 

Go hurl your bullshit elsewhere then.

 

Haha get off my nuts child, peace

[GBK16]

I dunno if I'm more interested in the ground change discussion or Tosen vs BillyRose

[TJMitchell]

I dunno if I'm more interested in the ground change discussion or Tosen vs BillyRose

 

This for sure

[BillyRose]

I dunno if I'm more interested in the ground change discussion or Tosen vs BillyRose

 

little cumstain wants to follow me around and puff out his chest, he'll get put back down every time.

 

I'm 2 for 2.

 

But really, you can get better feuds than this. I'm all for a good shit-talking session but it has to at least be competitive.

[Mannetosen]

Context matters, yeah. I have had hundreds of fights against other top level managers before I quit playing, and the engine has barely changed since then. That gives me at least a baseline understanding of how the game works. I looked over your other fighters as well and none of them have any top level experience whatsoever. That in itself doesn't mean that you don't understand how this game works. Your endless stream of idiotic, uninformed posts do, however.

 

Also, elementary school level name calling coming from an adult is really pathetic.

[Marky]

 

I am not saying the ground game cannot or should not be tweaked, however there is serious implications to all these changes. For one, fighter development takes ages, months. If you suddenly alter what is effective, it basically means that your fighter build can become obsolete. In the past changes to the fight engine ALWAYS lead to players leaving, the changes never increased players coming into the game though. So why make a change that can decrease members even more?

 

There is one other thing, past changes to the fight engine did not always lead to a better overall game, in fact i could argue that in some cases it made things worse. Can this game really afford another mistake? Let's all be honest here, the game overall is going downhill and that has been the case for a while, things are so bad that people i never thought i would even talk to, i am now collaborating with, simply because we do not have a lot of choice, there is so few active members that you have to find a compromise. A change like this could be the final blow to many top level managers who are on the verge of leaving. Besides this, most people would agree that the fight engine is at least playable, there are other parts of this game which need sorting out. Those changes will only enhance the game and will increase the player enjoyment in general.

 

Restoring some balance does not make one's roster obsolete, if it did then the manager is a complete fool building fighters like that and knowing only one way to fight. You just have to actually think how to set the sliders rather than take advantage of the current engine status and the magically working formula. Escapes should be an option in the future too but right now it's just ridiculous. Have you checked the pops of any fighter that trains escapes? You can see the amount of gain from that session when they have popped from the tycoon assistant. Compare that value to any other skill that popped at similar skill range, it's like doubled value. For example, one of my guys popped escapes from feeble to mediocre last week, gained 3.67 points from that session. When he popped from feeble to mediocre in transitions (he was much younger then and obviously had better learning speed than now) he gained 1.71 points. Now I wonder why everybody has sens-elite escapes. Add to the fact that the engine allows spamming that elite skill in a fight, it's just not right and I cannot find a reason why this hasn't been fixed a long long time ago. It's just little tweaks.

 

It's always the complaint that managers may leave if something is to be changed. Well, managers may leave just as well because things are not changed. It's incredibly frustrating to constantly get fight offers at the top level where you already know what the opponent's gameplan will be and that your guy with variety of skills cannot use most of them to mix it up since the first one to go for the takedown loses. And the fights are always the same shit, many times you just know how it's going to go before you start reading it. That kind of MMA Tycoon is no fun.

[Mentor]

Anyway, you guys do not need to worry, nothing much has changed in the past 2-3 years, so it is unlikely something drastic like this will even happen. There is enough things in the errors forums to work on for 6 months anyway, those are bigger priority than engine change #8.

[JimCornette]

How many black/red belts are in the UFC and how many are in this game?

 

Truth is that striking is heavily favored in this game and just having elite def grappling + some transitions/escapes is enough to be solid on the ground vs fighters who spent at least half of their skill cap mastering the ground game. Either make tweaks to ground skills effect (nerfing escapes/def grappling) or somehow limit primary skills so not every fighter is Elite wrestler/Brown and above BJJ belt - though as the fight of CK proves, that might not be enough.

I agree with limiting primary skills. That is the one thing that seems to be a bigger flaw in my opinion. Allowing every fighter to be a black belt, essentially in everything is just boring and unrealistic. Completely agree with that.

[GBK16]

Despite the fact my fighter builds are pretty much geared towards the current engine of Anti-Grappling - This game is in dire need of a change but sadly I don't believe we will receive any in the near future.

 

I think it's pretty much a given that Mike is paying more attention to his betting site than he is the game right now, and the game is dying slowly. We've had an influx of new managers recently but the game hasn't had any major changes in a long time now. We were supposed to get a huge engine change last year and it never happened. We've been getting warnings of a Physical cap being brought in for nearly a year now with Mike saying he was almost finished with it and that still hasn't come in.

 

For the complaint about Fight Engines potentially not working, you could use The Island as a way to test out any potential changes. People for a while now have been asking about changing up The Island seasons to keep them interesting - Implementing potential engine changes could be a way to do it. Combine it possibly with an overall increased starting skill points total and you'll be able to get a good idea on it before you bring it to the entire game.

 

While bringing about engine changes might cause a few managers to leave, allowing the game to grow stale is a terrible idea. I personally thought Mike should look to do any engine changes once a year and then over the course of the rest of the year look to make any additional changes but realistically I have little hope for any changes in the near future.

[Mannetosen]

I started playing this game almost exactly 8 years ago today. The ground game has been stupid and broken for almost all of them. The last engine revamp was in what, 2013, and didn't do much to be honest.

[BillyRose]

Context matters, yeah. I have had hundreds of fights against other top level managers before I quit playing, and the engine has barely changed since then. That gives me at least a baseline understanding of how the game works. I looked over your other fighters as well and none of them have any top level experience whatsoever. That in itself doesn't mean that you don't understand how this game works. Your endless stream of idiotic, uninformed posts do, however.

Also, elementary school level name calling coming from an adult is really pathetic.

 

 

Wow your e-peen is so big, how many imaginary fights do I need before I can read basic output like you?

 

 

Because here I am around 60, and I've had plenty of ground mismatches that I've won.

 

Might be because I understand the engine well enough to actually play the game.

 

 

 

Nah jk I'm just another bitter old shithead and I'm gonna cry about this "broken" game I refuse to leave because I know better than the developer.

[Rambo]

Wow your e-peen is so big, how many imaginary fights do I need before I can read basic output like you?

 

 

Because here I am around 60, and I've had plenty of ground mismatches that I've won.

 

Might be because I understand the engine well enough to actually play the game.

 

 

 

Nah jk I'm just another bitter old shithead and I'm gonna cry about this "broken" game I refuse to leave because I know better than the developer.

 

you're still just as clueless as you were before you returned under a new moniker.

 

you can't find a competent manager or person in this game that's been around here for a couple years that will tell you the ground game doesn't need tweaking in some way or another. to what degree, that's up for debate. it's a consensus that it needs improvement.

 

find me one fight where a double elite striker only landed 20% of his strikes vs a Remarkable/Respectable striker. you can't. striking efficiency is far superior to grappling efficiency.